Code Usage Etiquette?

[Zylli42]

I am making a program for non-profit use for a gaming community.  The program takes some inputs and calculates some things that are otherwise hard to calculate due to the complexity of the game.  I would like to make it available to the general public by posting it on SourceForge, but copyright laws are a gray area for me.

The issue is my code uses some functions I found on these forums.  Other than giving credit to their user names and sending them a PM, do I need to worry about any rights they may claim to the code?

[iamtheky]

Nope, and the things you mentioned are just niceties.

[TheSaint]

Hi Zylli42, welcome to the forum.

Did you perchance read the forum rules on your way in?

See the bottom right of every forum page for the link.

Particularly the section on Gaming and/or Botting.

Many here, would not be happy with you using their code for something that contravenes the rules here or their personal beliefs about unfairness.

Perhaps you should give more detail about what it is you've done for this (unnamed) gaming community.

Edited February 19, 2015 by TheSaint

[Zylli42]

My code does not violate the forum rules.  I don't want to release it to the public or announce what game it is for until it is tested by my gaming clan.

My program is a form of a calculator.  It does not interact with any other executable in any way.  It requires manual input of some numbers and produces a list of results, which are displayed within the program's window.

[TheSaint]

So you've ok'd that with the Game's creator, and it is not against their TOS, and it doesn't give an advantage over others without it?

P.S. I wouldn't go by what boththose says, as some here do post their code with conditions. He just likes to be controversial.

In any case, you should show respect.

[Melba23]

Zylli42,

As I understand it the copyright of any published material rests with the author unless specifically renounced. But posting code on a public site such as this without having imposed any formal licencing requirements means that, although the code is not strictly in the public domain, the author is unlikely to object to it being used elsewhere. Of course, that is a layman opinion and has no weight in law.

Acknowledging that some sections of the code within a script were produced by others would be polite, but I completely understand the comment above regarding the possibility that some authors might not wish to be associated with certain end products. However, if the attribution were carefully worded to make clear that their contribution was solely as authors of the original code and that they were not involved personally in the specific project, I cannot imagine that you would cause much offence.

M23

[Zylli42]

So you've ok'd that with the Game's creator, and it is not against their TOS, and it doesn't give an advantage over others without it?

P.S. I wouldn't go by what boththose says, as some here do post their code with conditions. He just likes to be controversial.

In any case, you should show respect.

 

I am working on obtaining the permission from the game's creator.  

The advantage it gives is in decision-making only.  It reduces or eliminates the need for trial and error in creating a "character build" by following mathematical rules instead of spending a lot of time guessing and trying something.  It isn't the only tool available to do such a thing but it is designed to be more accurate than previous tools.  All of the math used is public knowledge.

Does this forum allow sending private messages?  How do I obtain permission to send private messages so I can request permission from the people whose code I incorporated into my program?

[czardas]

I believe you can use the PM system after making so many posts but I don't remember exactly - it's not too many. Anyway, I would first wait until you get permission from the developers of the game, before contacting any code authors. It's unlikely anyone will say no, but they might not all respond.

This does not appear to be about game automation in a direct sense, which is an unacceptable topic on this forum. The possibility of gaining an unfair advantage over other players may still concern the game developers. Perhaps it will be less of a concern to them if it is shared openly with other players like you suggest. First get confirmation.

[Melba23]

Zylli42,

I have adjusted your permissions so that you can now PM other members.

However, as czardas has suggested, I suggest you wait until you have permission from the game developers before contacting anyone. If you do not get permission and still decide to proceed with the script I propose you drop any idea of crediting anyone - as associating others with what would be an unapproved app would not be a good idea.

M23

[jvanegmond]

The laws concerning this scenario are broken beyond belief. Placing anything on the internet means you are distributing your software to every country, you need to comply with all of their individual laws. You're not only dealing with classical author copyright (since code is text and someone authored it), you're dealing with software patents as well and don't forget overly broad laws like the PATRIOT act which can be used against you no matter where you live or what you're doing. And most countries do extradite to the US for blatantly made-up charges, consider yourself fortunate if yours doesn't. 

It takes a lifetime to really study the relevant laws concerning what you're doing if you're limiting yourself to distribution in a single country, if you're distributing to the world it takes many many multiples of lifetimes -- or an army of lawyers. This is generally why web-based companies will launch in a single country and make their services available in other countries at a later date, once they know their service is profitable and they have the equity to be able to afford plenty of lawyers in said country.

On the upside, despite all of the brokenness and frivolous lawsuits, the world keeps spinning, the sun comes up for nothing and the internet is still working to a reasonable degree. You can waste a lot of time on licensing your code to cover your ass, but in practice it doesn't work and you might as well have slapped on something that looks good and official (eg MIT or Apache). Generally speaking, if you're not doing it for profit, it is better to ask forgiveness rather than permission and try not to upset anyone with power/money/influence to send mean looking lawyers and threatening letters your way.

[TheSaint]

I concur with Manadar.

Really at the end of the day, the world works best on respect and consideration of others.

What comes around, truly does go around ... though it might not be obvious.

Personally, I'm not in favor of gaming aids, for there is an element of unfair advantage.

That said, many have a disability or an unfair advantage anyway, just due to their own makeup.

Life is unbalanced, and I'm not a great fan of competitiveness, because generally, the same few always seem to win, and the majority loses.

Still, there are the laws of nature to consider, and life is not about fairness ... and where would we be without progress.

What really rankles and irks me, is those who are blessed, but find it necessary to cheat as well.

[iamtheky]

really, multiple governments involved, and a morality play?  I was not being controversial, I was shooting more for actuality:

You dont need any sort of permission from the game creator, publisher, or mother to make a walk-through or decision tree.  Moreover, you will find very little code on the forums that does not have an abundance of prior art (probably find most of it in the help file), getting individual permission for what is most likely GUI elements and an ini is nice, but absolutely not necessary.

[BrewManNH]

This sticky question is why I added into my signature that all the code I post here is free to use by all. Whether it's valid legally isn't important, it tells everyone that I don't care if they use anything I post and I'm not coming after them if they use it.

[MikahS]

You dont need any sort of permission from the game creator, publisher, or mother to make a walk-through or decision tree.

Some games in early access or beta or whatnot will forbid this.    Having a look at the Official Policy is what is going to help you determine what you can do.

Otherwise, I doubt a calculator, which does not interact with the game in any way, will be against policy. As, someone dedicated to MMO's in their past have seen many create their own "gear" calculators. As long as, the application is not interacting or affecting gameplay, then you should be fine. But, if the Official Policy states that no 3rd party applications are a loud, then you are going against the set rules.

I'm the same as BrewManNH, you can use my code and I have clearly stated that. As, if it was used for something malicious that is all on you, as you were the one to use the code for malicious intent.

 

[jvanegmond]

boththose, walkthroughs could be derivative works under copyright law similar to Let's plays. Their legality is questionable and differs per country. Whether they're fair use is yet to be determined but a lot of large studios are creating partner programs specifically for this purpose to avoid the legal questions. Yes, there is prior art for a lot of code on the forums, but the point is that law applies, in every country you're distributing to, and that you may find yourself presenting such prior art in court in defense of a patent lawsuit.